NSFW Pod 024 - Samantha St. James

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[00:00:00] Matthew Holliday: Good day, everyone. And welcome back to the not safe for work photography podcast. There are thousands of models and photographers, creating adult content, using modern platforms and taking control of their own creative lives. Today we're interviewing Samantha St. James. This is Samantha's first podcast and she started working in the adult industry when she moved to LA to go to. 

She started in men's magazines and music videos, and then got into adult films. She's coming to us from her house in Miami, which is apparently the current adult work capital. How should we go in Samantha? 

[00:00:39] Samantha St. James: Well, I live in paradise, so pretty good in that. 

[00:00:43] Matthew Holliday: I mean, especially over the next couple of months, I was down in Tampa in January a couple of years ago, and it was amazing. 

[00:00:49] Samantha St. James: Yeah, Tampa. The funny thing that people don't know is Tampa has been the BDSM and fetish Capitol. Um, since all of the companies that were normally eat like in the east coast, all moved to Tampa about 10 years ago. Um, so Tampa and is really the BDSM like fetish Capitol everyone's down there. Now, like every company I worked for in New York and up through. 

Even New Hampshire. They're all down in Tampa now. 

[00:01:15] Matthew Holliday: I go visit someone for work down there. I'm going to have to bring my camera and gear next time. Apparently. Geez. 

[00:01:20] Samantha St. James: Yeah. It's a thing 

[00:01:23] Matthew Holliday: So you started working and adult work back in 1993. That was your first release, right? 

[00:01:30] Samantha St. James: first. Um, adult hardcore release. Yeah. 

[00:01:35] Matthew Holliday: Oh, you were doing stuff before that. 

[00:01:37] Samantha St. James: Yeah. Um, actually I started, when I moved to LA to go to college in the mid eighties, um, I was actually under age, but did not do any magazine work until I was 18, obviously. Um, my main 

[00:01:51] Matthew Holliday: Traci Lords. 

[00:01:53] Samantha St. James: Oh God. Um, that was hilarious. And she was so much, she's so much smarter than anyone thought she was. 

Um, anyway, that thing was that, that was awful. I'm a mainstream agent had gotten me a lot of film and TV and music videos. And he, I was just lucky finding this man who passed away years ago. He was a great, he was the one agent that was mainstream sag, sag, licensed and bonded, but he also booked some softcore BDSM stuff, the Playboy channel, Cinemax, Showtime soft core stuff. 

Um, and he. Uh, books magazines as well. Um, he, funny enough, the first day I went in to interview Demi Moore and a couple other actresses had been with him for mainstream. Acting work and then had done magazines and core dealt work to pay the bills while they were struggling. So I remember it's a funny story. 

I remember him showing me a photo albums of her and a couple other people. Here's the ending to the story. He was an older, so super sweet gentlemen. His name was hel goo and it was CHN international on Santa Monica Boulevard. And he'd been there since the sixties. He was elderly when I got into the business and when he passed away, He had no children. 

And, uh, just a collection of like rescue parrots that he had found, he had found he was, he had cancer and he had found someone to take the parents. And he was, um, he was not long for this world. He was quite ill and he ended up in a Hollywood ending. He ended up offering him. In the office and what the place on fire, because he didn't want anyone because the sets that he had built in there were in like every softcore and BDSM photo-shoot magazine, the film from the sixties, through the nineties and the wardrobe and props he had. 

Um, and he didn't want it all getting brokered off or scavenged through. So yeah, bring the place to the ground. And to this day he didn't leave it to anyone. So it's just. Space where he used to be, which is sad because he was a lovely, lovely man who took care of his talent. So that's how I got into it. I started, they offered, they were paying like ridiculous money to do a magazine shoots, even on spec, even if it wasn't being directly shot for, um, see Playboy penthouse or whatever. 

Uh, and then a lot of the photographers were doing some artsy nude bondage, fetish, sort of. Erotic stuff on the side. And because I was so easy to work with and fun and wanting to explore a lot of things, I made a lot of money just shooting side stuff for people's side art portfolios or their side erotic fetish art gig that they were doing. 

Um, and then that fell into them referring me for mainstream. I won't mention brands, but mainstream shoots where a model wouldn't show up for a big jeans company and they would just call me into, like, I know. She'll be here. She's amazing. So I worked a lot in mainstream modeling because of some of the adultish photographers I worked with. 

Um, and then I had the music videos, and then that got me into working for some of the bigger magazines. She got me more work for starring in a lot of these Playboys. And I'm actually out time things, which I can't get my hands on. So if anyone listening knows where the Cinemax Playboy channel shows. Uh, they were shot directly for them by them between this would have been much just say late eighties to early nineties where those are. 

I would love to see them add them to my I MDB or IFT, um, along with a bunch of MTV stuff, new year's Eve parties and a couple of interviews I did for them. Um, I would also like to wait to get a hold of. 

[00:05:49] Matthew Holliday: So you don't have access to this anymore. 

[00:05:52] Samantha St. James: I don't think anyone does, they got bought out so many times that there's somewhere probably in like a dusty warehouse somewhere, you know, the back of the San Fernando valley. 

Um, they, they exist somewhere. I'm sure they haven't been digitized or we call arrised, which really is a treasure trove. So anyone, anyone out there as creative, they should find all that. 

[00:06:13] Matthew Holliday: Ah, all right. So what was it like working in the adult industry back then in the nineties? 

[00:06:19] Samantha St. James: Five better than it is today. And anyone who says, oh, it's better now because everyone creates their own content and anybody can shoot no back in the day, there were, there was one top agent who, um, knew I'd been working for as a regular mainstream model and actress and some soft core adult stuff. How new Jim. 

And he said, Rob, you're going to start doing the adult stuff. You know, I can still book it for the BDSM and the fetish and magazine stuff, but he's the only one that does like hardcore and I don't do that. So I was like, okay. So I walked into Jim south office, the gym south, the porn agent from, you know, 19 70, 60, 70 is on three when he passed away. 

And that motherfucker was, you don't want to fuck with them. Like you definitely knew. This is a guy originally from Texas who. It feels like if a big company ripped them off or tried to do something shitty, somebody would definitely show up with a gun. Um, but he was, he stood by his talent. He took care of talent. 

He made sure you got your testing and it was paid for that. You got paid that if you were like me and said, look, I want to be first scene of the day. I'm not going to sit around and wait for six hours because somebody was late. I want to pick the guys I work with, you know, he, he was 150% behind you. Love the guy I walked in his office whenever this was 90. I want to say it was 92. It was between 92, 93. I was actually have left Los Angeles and was living here in Florida in 92. After my fiance died of cancer, I moved here. Uh, just kind of get away from LA and I had done. Some amateur stuff in our other system. Funny, I'm just remembering this. I had done some amateur stuff in Orlando with a company whose name I can't remember, but I think they're still in business. 

Um, super sweet couple. They were shooting like amateur boy, girl stuff and curl girl stuff. I actually did my first video with the first couple of videos in Orlando at this company whose name? I can't remember. And I'm sorry if you're hearing this, but I remember it was dirty, Bob, the reviewers birthday, and they had me sing happy birthday as Marilyn Monroe. And he gave me like a five star review on both my scenes. And I was like, you should be in LA and really like be a star because you obviously enjoy what you're doing and you're amazing performer and super fun and whatever. So that's how it started. And when I walked into Jim's Al's office, his, his famous race was as I live in bed. 

And I was like, yes. And he's like, so you're finally coming out of the dark side. All right, set me up. And he's like, what are you going to do? What are you not going to do? So we went through the whole list and he started booking me for, for the first time pro videos, which was ed at somebody. They paid five grand for the first boy girl professional video on scene. 

And then there was a second to when that paid three. And then obviously your first email, your first DP and your first gang-bang all paid. These were all three to $5,000. And, and, uh, um, which is similar to what the magazines were paying, but I'd already been shot out. Cause I'd been in every men's magazine from a to Z doing solos, girls, girls, boy, girls, whatever. 

So, um, yeah, so I just don't know the role with, with Jim south for about five years. 

[00:09:39] Matthew Holliday: What's different about shooting a boy, girl scene between photography, yours, and videographers. 

[00:09:46] Samantha St. James: Um, if you're shooting a photo set. I mean back in the day. I don't, I don't see. No, I don't know if anyone's still shoots just stills, you know? Cause it used to be like Playboy or penthouse would have at a hustler would have a boy girl set or a girl girl set. Right. But there was no, they would show they wouldn't. I'm trying to remember. Um, because it was stills. A lot of it was, you know, just kinda like open your mouth. Um, so they would either show, you know, the deck like six inches from your face, or it's already like all in you. Like there was no in between. Um, I remember working with some guys that were gay, that hated the whole thing for, for magazine work. 

And I was like, just set up and make I'll do all the work, just show up and make it look good. You know? Cause it was still isn't it was easier to fake. So I don't know if someone is doing just straight photography girl, girl, boy, girl. How that's going to work these days. I don't know because people are shitting couples. 

Um, a lot of people are just coming in as couples. There's all different genres. There's the heavily tattooed peers, you know, hardcore market. There's no tattoos and piercings sort of All-American looking market. Um, suggest if you're not shooting. Well-established people or a couple, I mean, you've gotta be real careful that you're getting what you're booking and that the shit's going to go well. 

Um, and if you're shooting a hardcore scene, even in photos where there's going to be penetration, you've got to make sure that people have been tested. And I know all the companies run everybody through talent testing and there's VIP testing. Um, For a lot of people, they can't drop 180 $200 every three weeks to get tested. 

So I have always kept a testing record in either quest or lab Corp where I'll get all the testing. My doctor ordered get them done at the lab. My insurance pays for it, but I have a full record. So if someone can show you three months of tests on quest or lab Corp, I would say accept them. But if they don't any kind of hardcore you straight gay and all of the above, you've got to have people with testing, like. 

[00:11:57] Matthew Holliday: All right. So you hit a couple things there that I want to, I want to talk about the testing. I want to talk about the hiring, but let's do the testing first. Cause you dived into that. See, so there's a, there's currently a company, I guess it sounds like that does most of the hardcore tech. 

[00:12:12] Samantha St. James: Talent testing has been around for a long time. They were, I believe the second tier company in LA. Um, I was registered with them, but never tested with them. Cause I was using another company. That was across the street from my point agent's office, so convenient. And he was paying, um, yes, there's talent testing and VIP testing, the legit porn companies, content, creators, and shooters that are actually paying models and actresses for scenes or compensating them somehow, even if it's a shared use. Are sending people there to get tested, which is great. The difference in testing between back in the day, and now is originally you only have a half an HIV test that came about when I got into hardcore, that's all they tested you for is you had to go get a PCR DNA. No, you only have to get a rapid HIV test and you could work if you got it in the morning and it came back negative. 

You could work late that day. And then there were some massive HIV, uh, Uh, in the industry and they made everyone get a PCR DNA and then wait three days to go to work. So that came around the early nineties. Now they're doing a PCR, DNA, HIV one and two RPR, which is syphilis, chlamydia gonorrhea, a couple of bacterial infections for women, which is, seems just a no brainer, but useless to test for, um, What else? 

Uh, oh, they're testing for the antigen to hepatitis a and B to see if you have the vaccine or if you are infected hepatitis C, if you've had the vaccine or been treated for it, or if you're currently infected, which are great. The two things that no one's ever tested for which I was advocating with the early adult industry Guild. 

Became what it is now, early nineties was the testing standards of you should get like a little plastic membership card. Um, like your picture re you know, stage name, real name, birthday, whatever, and, um, some sort of ID number. And if you test positive for, uh, huddles one in town, it should be on the card. 

And if you test positive for HPV, it should be on the card. Um, and if you're. Had tested positive, put her now negative for anything else. I mean, it shouldn't be on there because I've always felt talent should know that they're working with someone who has herpes one and two or HPV because you know what I mean? 

You know, if they're active, you're going to get it by working with them. And that's a couple of things I've never tested for, but I've always felt like people should know that. Um, 

[00:14:55] Matthew Holliday: Um, 

[00:14:56] Samantha St. James: but you know, 

[00:14:59] Matthew Holliday: And I've definitely heard on some sex, positive podcasts where HPV is not that big of a deal because so many people have it. But, uh, I do think I do agree. It should probably, it shouldn't be left to 

[00:15:10] Samantha St. James: And they can't say it's not that big of a deal because. It needs to cervical cancer and a couple other kinds of cancer. And if you get it in your throat, like a couple of mainstream musicians and actors did from apparently eating a lot of pussy, uh, it can cause it can cause throat cancer. And if left unchecked, you know, you lose your voice, um, and have to have some really bad surgeries and radiation. 

So HPV actually is a big deal. Um, everybody should be, like I said, should be tested for, and if you're positive, At least the person I'm working with, you should know, and you should be aware enough that if you are a positive to male or female, to get, you know, checked every few months, like by a doctor to see if you have any, you know, an outbreak and then, and then get them removed. 

I've actually seen NYSE. Um, That is supposed to work with with like, you know, each PV bumps. And I'm like, uh, dude, we're putting a condom on, I'm not fucking working with you. Like, you know what that is? And they've said, oh, well, everybody's got it. And I'm like, yeah, I'm not trying to get cervical cancer. 

You don't fuck. You need to go to a urologist and get that shit burned off your Dick and get tested for it and get on high dose Valcyclovir, which is the anti herpes medication that also prevents outbreaks of HPV. So, yeah, it's a big deal. And I've also heard people say, well, everyone in the industry has herpes. 

So I mean, if you're going to be in it more than two weeks, you're going to get herpes. And I'm like, again, that causes all kinds of issues. If you're planning on having children, which a lot of these young girls are, you can't do a vaginal delivery because you're going to have a severe herpes outbreak and it can lead to blindness in your child among other things. 

So it is a big fucking deal. Um, and you should, like I said, I've always advocated for, you should know. And they're like, oh, well privacy. And I'm like privacy and porn there. It should be stamped on the card. And then there was some traction on that. Um, I mean, it's, they've progressed and they're obviously testing for a lot more stuff. 

Uh, but those are two things you should have to be tested for. And it'd be like a S like a permanent stamper or a punch, like a, they should punch out a star on the back of the card for her BS in HPV, if you've had it, you know, and they should be giving people. Medication for it. And, and literally, they literally throw prep at anybody now who works in the adult industry, but they're not giving people high-dose spells like Levair and then a low dose, daily maintenance after a liver check to make sure their herpes and their HPV isn't breaking out to where they're going to pass it onto someone. 

It's just part of that like dumb fuck thing in the industry that I've, I've never done it. And it's not the talent. It's the responsibility of the testing companies on the agents. 

[00:17:47] Matthew Holliday: I wonder if it's, because they're worried that too many people will have it and if they start flying in those people, but if you have it, you can still work with other actors and actresses that have it. 

[00:17:58] Samantha St. James: If you've had hepatitis a and a B it'll show, an active infection, or just that you have antibodies to it, which means of two different types, which means a you've been vaccinated against hepatitis a and B, which is what my antibodies show up as, because I've had the vaccine. Well, like one of my male friends that showed up that he had a previous infection to hepatitis B, but cleared it and is now having antibodies to it. 

But an active infection is a big deal. Um, so yeah, I mean, it is important to task for all the, for all the hepatitis like they do, but it's weird that they won't ask for the herpes or. Um, HPV, because if you've had any of the hepatitises, there's the variety of courses of drugs that will help your body clear it, similar to what prep does for HIV early infection. But like I said, you know, people show up positive for herpes, they should test. Um, and they should immediately, you know, get on me high dose, like limited Clara and then a low dose daily maintenance. So they won't have an outbreak. They'll be able to work without gaping goosing sores on their genitals, and then we'll pass it on to anybody it's sorta like hepatitis it's kind of a responsibility thing. 

And I think you, as someone working in the industry, especially the younger girls that get into it and have no idea what they're getting into, you should know that like, anyway, you should, you should know what you're working with. 

[00:19:17] Matthew Holliday: All right. So let's, let's pivot from there for those talking about disgusting using gaping sores. 

[00:19:22] Samantha St. James: Sexy. 

[00:19:24] Matthew Holliday: I know, right? If someone is getting into adult work, especially now with the creator economy and they show up on set with somebody they're supposed to be filming with, what should they expect to bring and what should they expect to see in regards to testing? 

[00:19:42] Samantha St. James: Yeah. There's professional companies, like just say, let's just use like who they work for that I like not America shoots down here. Right? So let's say you're using 90 America. And then on the other side of the coin, Bob's phony brides, next door, content creation. Right? So any professional company in anybody getting into the industry or anybody who wants to start shooting things in the industry, you should arrange a bunch of stuff ahead of time, not just confirm your date and time that you're booking people for you should confirm if they're in the talent testing system and have a history, uh, where they can check tests over a period of time that you're being responsible. 

Um, Or that they've got a testing history in another non industry platform like quest or LabCorp, um, like I do, right. Uh, you should see the testing history ahead of time. You should make sure that if you're seen as like a Monday, the first that they're going a week before to get all the required tests and that they've signed a release. 

So the, that the producer director, whoever can get a copy of it. What normally you used to provide on set and I'm going to sound so professional here, but. Professional knee is I normally was told to back in the day, and this is how it worked back in the day. And I don't think it works like this now, but, um, I always bring and was always told to bring two copies of my IDs, which is the driver's license passport and a second form of ID. 

Yeah. Debit card, social security card, something else with your name on it. Right. So I always bring two copies of my, these two copies of my tasks. And, um, because I'm incorporated, I bring two copies of a w nine, which has my business and my business tax ID on it versus my name and my social. So I can prepared, um, used to have to do that back in the day. 

Now. I don't think they make you do it. I think they copy your ideas, copy your tests and make you fill out the w nine, uh, there. Uh, but those are the things I come prepared with to make everyone's life easier. And when you actually show up prepared like that, the producer director, whoever is just like, wow, this person's on it. 

You know, like, and they'll remember that. I used to be told, I would confirm what wardrobe I was supposed to bring. Is this like slutty teacher, a neighbor next door. Is this just. Stripper dress with the g-string under it. Like what wardrobe, what accessories, what shoes, how do you want my hair and makeup? 

Or there's a hair and makeup person there. Um, the bigger company is, will tell you all this ahead of time. Um, the smaller companies and independent shooters I've found at least kind of dipping my toes back in the industry. They don't, uh, and I've always asked again to be professional. Okay, well, should I be buying some new neon? 

Thing on Amazon. Uh, do you want me to go get a spray tan? Like, should I have tan lines or not? Do you like my nail Polish to be red? Can I wear black or you want French manicure or should I be Brazilian or still have a. You know, upside down triangle of hair, you know, should my hair be blown out or currently, like, how do you want my makeup? 

And people are amazed these days that I'm so professional that this is the way you had to conduct yourself. If you really wanted to work, you know, back in the day, cause you're competing with and why I'm hot and sexy and privy and was a real regular model. I mean, there were some women in the industry at the time I was in it that were just, you know, dropped at stupid, gorgeous. 

I mean, Terry wiggle, you know, it was the playmate of the year. Um, one really pretty girl. And then there was a bunch of really gorgeous girls who were in the adult industry who were just flawless and trying to work with them or compete with them for jobs. I mean, you really had to up your game and be super professional, right. 

Besides, you know, keeping yourself super fit. Um, so those are the things I would ask if you were. And if you're a sh if you're shooting something like you're a photographer or a producer, I would figure out ahead of time and be real specific and not take for granted that talent, especially new talent is given show up with anything more than themselves. 

So I would, you know, figure out what you're going to shoot and what they need to bring and how you want them to look at how a time. 

[00:23:54] Matthew Holliday: That sounds like a lot of work to do. 

[00:23:56] Samantha St. James: But like, I just see, maybe it's just me, but that's why I've always had a really good reputation. And mainstream and adult is I'm trying to make like our day easier and our day goes smoothly because it's both our time. Right. So I want to be on time and have everything ready and be prepared and be being, looking exactly how you want me to look and doing exactly what you want me to do. 

And that's how I want to be, because I've seen so many people show. Even having been told all that, no ID, I forgot it. Deal with like, shit they're hung over there. They should be tan that there goes white. They didn't get waxed. They're sorta half grown in that three inches of ruts. Their nail Polish is chipping off you. 

I got the same thing with guys. Not so as much though, the guys, the industry usually are really on it because there's so much more competition for seeds work. You know, girls, girls, they allow, they always, at least used to allow more irresponsibility and bad behavior. But, um, I just want to make everyone's day easier and be professional. 

It seems like there's a lot less professionality in the business these days though. At least the short time I've been here, especially on the, uh, online, only content shooter. As far as the content trade people approaching me. I, I don't do content trade because I don't have an only fans. I apparently do have a PornHub X hamster and X hamster and some other channels that I was not aware that I had. 

So there's going to be a little, we need to have a conversation about someone making money off my content, but I don't, I don't shoot my own content. I'm not interested in shooting my own content. It's it's not, if you weren't in only fans, it's sort of like if you got in early. You're making money if you keep up with it. 

But a lot of people got in during the pandemic and after, and it's very difficult when you have, you know, like a hundred million people doing the same sort of thing, ish, and everyone's kind of already got all the Nisha's covered, even if you're on social 24 7, and you know how to market your stuff. And you're, crossposting on four different platforms and you've got someone doing all your hashtags and keywords and SEO. 

It's a lot of work. And it's relatable, successful. You'd need to hire someone to really handle all that for you while you're doing it yourself. And I've seen the numbers and there's for all of that. If you're spending a grand a month to get your stuff out there, you're making a grand a month or maybe two back, and it's a full basically full-time job. 

So now, unless you somehow go viral and. And someone discovers who you really are or something. And then you can do an only fans and drop something like that. One girl did, it made a million bucks overnight, but that's rare. So yeah, when people say, oh, well we do content trade. I'm like, okay, one, you're going to broker the scene off to four or five different channels and you're going to cut four or five different scenes out of it and probably 20 different clips to sell. 

Um, but you want me to sign a release and not get paid? No. And that's a, that's a big thing that a lot of guys are using to get growth, you know, into doing a lot of free content for them. It's sort of like this lazy producers back in the day that would tell. Uh, it would tell a guy, Hey, you get me three girls for this scene. 

I'll pay you five grand. Just pay them whatever you want, you get to keep the rest. So the agent producer, pimp, whatever, we'll tell the girls, oh, you're getting 500 is seen because you're new and he would bank the other, you know, three grand. Um, that's kinda, that's kind of the new, the new pimp. The new sleazy boyfriend is. 

Low-end content creator, guys who are getting girls to do all kinds of shit for free. And they're making, they're making money out the gate with it, which is like, again, not cool, but no one there's no squirrels for like how to get into porn. What to look out for. I don't know. I feel like I need it. I feel like I need my own podcast about. 

[00:27:59] Matthew Holliday: That's my guess is grind. So you mentioned, I think you got $5,000 for your first scene. And a lot of scenes after that were in the 3000 range, is, was that the standard rate at the. 

[00:28:10] Samantha St. James: It depended on if you were working for like a big company, like vivid, wicked, VCA, uh, Ching VA, a lot of the brewery, big, a less companies. Right. And then were you going to be an aimless contract girl or were you like a B-list girl? I was always a B-list girl because I wasn't, you know, a Playboy playmate and I looked great, but I didn't have 42 double X boobs. 

And anyway, so it was five men from the first boy, girl, I think three for the second. I think two for the two for the third. I think my first, I want to say my first anal was like two grand and my first DP was three back in the day. The standard rate was, I want to say a thousand for a boy, girl, basically for everybody. 

Right? It's like a thousand dollars for a boy, girl. I think it was 600 for a girl, girl, and 400 for a solo masturbation, 300 for a cookie. Blow job, hand job or foot job thing, but those were always quickie things. The girl, girl, things were always more of a scene. Boy, girl, things were more of a scene. I think, I think anal is one guy, I think in a bumped it up to 12 or 1300. 

I think two guys was 1500. I think DP was 1800. 

[00:29:28] Matthew Holliday: I'm just imagining like a menu now with all these prices. 

[00:29:30] Samantha St. James: Yeah. I, I don't feel like I shouldn't do a writing thing on fat and be like, so here's the presence back in the day. She wasn't, my rates are now unless it's, you know, not a professional company and you're just shooting for some online stuff, then it'll be this much, this much, this much from my understanding. 

It's about half of that now for everything. So we just have everything. I just told you. That's what companies are paying. The reason the TAF is it's become. And if one more person says sex positive, I'm going to punch him in the face. It's just stupid word. It's like saying I'm pro-life instead of pro-choice it's like an oxymoron, right? 

Like I'm sex positive everybody's should be sex positive. Shut up. You're just not anti-porn anyway. Um, it's I think once a lot of the, and it wasn't the Pam Anderson, Tommy leaving once Kim Kardashians built a billion dollar empire on. Basically, they want a porn it's sort of, and then more celebrities accidentally started having their tapes linked, wink, wink. It became more socially acceptable because all of a sudden they were like these mainstream people with famous parents, or they have been on a big TV show, like more mainstream people's. Having those things leak and more people started doing it. And that became a thing. And then you started having some lower end senior Dean list, mainstream actresses, suddenly getting into porn, like Sasha gray. 

There was a whole bunch. So that sort of snowballed, I'd say about 10 years ago into it becoming more. Socially acceptable for women. Men will always allow it to be important in mainstream actors. It's hilarious, but women, it was always that, you know, Madonna whore theory, right? Like you need to the actress or the porn whore. 

It can't be both. Um, so it became more accessible and as younger millennials came up, became more stem nieces. The general social shift became more socially acceptable for women to express their sexuality, to, uh, to do more adult type things. And then it will explode. It I'd say in the past five years with, um, only fans and people started realizing your kid's best friend's mom needs to make some money because she's single. 

So she has got it. Only home. She said home at lunch. But the kids from app and in the shower, like filming herself, you know, with the pizza guy, like it suddenly became more mainstream where socially acceptable people knew people that were doing it. It wasn't like some hookers in Vegas. It's like, they knew the nice lady from the PTA was doing it. 

So, oh, well it must be like an okay business. So it's exploded. So you now have hundreds of millions of girls all over the world over the age of 18, getting into the industry. One, because it's more acceptable to some of them figure it'll up their rate of doing the feature dance gigs, or as a stripper, they'll actually get paid to strip and be featured, or they get sold this thing that like, oh, you're also gonna be able to do an only fans and shoot your own content and make like millions and millions of dollars every year. 

And you'll be the next gen Jamison or, uh, Joanna angel or somebody. Right. Which is like, not true, but there's more. There's more demand. It's more socially acceptable. And a lot of younger girls are who grew up with the, um, online Instagram, instant, like people love because I'm sexy thing that it's, they just sort of naturally fall into it. 

[00:33:08] Matthew Holliday: I'm stunned by. But the fact that you said that the prices were half or so now, because some of those prices are under what a new models are charging. I've I've spoken, I've interviewed with models that charge 350 an hour for photographers and charge upwards of a thousand dollars a day for a nude art shoot. 

Let alone anything pornographic. 

[00:33:30] Samantha St. James: It depends what your day rate is. So if I'm, I mean, if I'm going to be, there's a different, okay. Here's another point. There's a difference. And a lot of creepy guys, you know, and, and unscrupulous producer directors like to do day rate versus proceed, right. If you're doing a. Just say, uh, there's, there's sort of like doing a boy girl scene back in the day for just say like wicked right. 

Or a big company, um, where, you know, it was some acting, there was a theme behind it. Yeah. There was, there was a blow job scene then, you know, oral on you. And then there was, you know, like six possessions, missionary, cowgirl, reverse cowgirl, you know, doggy. Pile driver like any position they could think of. 

So it's like six positions, two orals to make an out dialogue, right. That could be if you were good and you worked with a male talent that you knew, you could bang that out for hours, but with hair and makeup and walking through the scene, you mean that's a whole day and they didn't book more than two things a day, right. 

Because it's still a 12 hour day for the crew. Um, nowadays. Well, there were people who would do little, little oral and a couple of positions pull out, come on our ass. Like it was shorter scenes. So it was a purse. It was still a rate to do the scene. But you know, you could book two things a day and you get paid less because it was a lot less work and it wasn't for a big company. 

It was for a, I'd say mid-level company. Right. Um, now as far as even means remodeling, you know, if it was a go in for. It's an all day campaign. You're going to have several different chain outfit changes. We're going to do this, this, this, and that. That's a date rate, but if it's, Hey, um, it's, uh, it's a shoot for one item of clothing, or we're just doing an ad for their new campaign. 

What will be a few hours? Same thing, right? That would be like a per scene rate or a percentage. So, yeah, I mean, as a new model, if it's a full day shoot, I mean, and I'm going to be there like eight hours with a break or six hours with a break, a thousand dollars is probably what I would charge, but if I'm only there for two hours and it's a solo art fetish thing, and it's just me, I mean, it depends on what it's for who it's for. 

It really just depends. There's like I said, there's dates and then there's per set rates, which is the same as a day rate or a. 

[00:35:56] Matthew Holliday: No that's fair. I was just, I was just thinking of, you mentioned. A couple of jobs or a hand job scene might only be $400. And now it may be half that. I was just like, Jesus, that's less than two hours, but I guess it would take less than 

[00:36:08] Samantha St. James: Oh, my God, I blow a blood drop right hand job scene. If you can't shoot that in 20 minutes, straight through, you're an idiot. And, and when people try to go look, well, we're going to be part of the blow job here. Probably a blow job, or what if he can come twice? Can we do it two different places? It's like, no, that's two different scenes that you're going to sell fuck off. 

I'm like, I got a foot job, a foot job scene the other day and literally edited down, which I wish talent knew this. There's a difference between shooting and edit it down content. Right. So. Yeah. If you can shoot straight through when you're a room doctor and you know, the person who wreck your laugh and you know, this company is going to edit this down to a 20 minute scene, you can probably shoot it straight through. 

And just 30 minutes just to give him a little extra here and there, if they needed like edit. But yeah, usually we'll do handout, blowjob, flip job, basic stuff like that. You can, you should be able to shoot it in half an hour. So. In and out an hour, the difference. And then again, if you're not a boy, girl, they just want a few possessions and a little oral, you should be able to bag that out and an hour or two, but that's different than you're going to be there for four hours. 

Cause we want 16 different things. 

[00:37:17] Matthew Holliday: Yeah. And I feel like a lot of content creators these days aren't doing, I mean, you know, in a lot of porn, there was sort of a prescribed do a little missionary to a little doggy style, reverse cowgirl, and then something crazy. But a lot of that content creators not just seem to be hammering it out. 

[00:37:32] Samantha St. James: Literally, I've seen a lot of stuff in there just doing like two positions and two positions in a facial or two positions in a creative bias, which is funny. Cause that's another thing that was never popular back in the day. The creepy. They always want to be able to pull out and jerk off on your Ted's or your ass, and then occasionally facials, but it was never the big thing than it is now. 

And nobody was doing cream pies. Except when you would shoot for Playboy Cinemax or Showtime, they would fake a cream pie because they couldn't show a guy pulling out and actually ejaculating. So they would fake a creepy cum shot, which was hilarious. 

[00:38:08] Matthew Holliday: Yeah. Lots of groans and lots of, you know, muscle assault. 

[00:38:12] Samantha St. James: But cream pies are real popular now. 

[00:38:14] Matthew Holliday: I know in the kind of the genre that if I ever get a chance to make, I want to do a cock and hot wife porn. I know that's a big part of that. Like the whole breeding 

[00:38:21] Samantha St. James: Yeah. Yeah. That's, that's definitely, really, the breeding thing is really, really hugely popular, um, as even a fantasy thing. And I've found that cause that's popular in porn now in my personal life in role-play the breeding thing is, you know, a big fag, which is hilarious because I'm way too old to breed and I've always was on birth control when. 

When I was at H debris. So it's hilarious, but it's a no, it's a, it's an adult role play fantasy thing too. 

[00:38:50] Matthew Holliday: Yeah. Yeah. All right. You mentioned there were several things in there that I wanted to. So you mentioned about hiring and about bringing in amateur male talent and such a, there's always such a competition for being male talent. I imagine that's probably a big problem for content creators now, too. 

[00:39:10] Samantha St. James: A lot of guys, and I've seen this in some scenes I've watched, um, all the young guys, obviously, you know, rock-hard could knock shit off the table with. With their cock, right? Cause then we on 20 20, 21, you know, early twenties, early thirties, right. And most of the guys now versus back in the day, they're in like really great fitness model shape, like between fitness model and light bodybuilder. 

They're mostly guys are really in amazing shape. There's a lot more good looking men in it. And a lot of former mainstream models and actors and musicians are in it now very similar to it's more socially acceptable. There's one guy that I knew. Oh, I won't mention who was a mainstream model actor and on, uh, well there's two, one was on Broadway and one was shows in Vegas and I knew that they had been doing some side content stuff was important. 

Girls. They knew just for fun and money. Um, who've gotten into porn big time now, some of the top dogs, cause they're tall, good luck, really good looking, hung, you know, really well-built and they're only picking and choosing to work with the better companies and that the more professional. Which is a funny, more socially acceptable thing, the guys too now. 

So they're on it, right? And they're all rock hard all the time. The wind blows the right way. They're comfortable walking around naked with a hard-on. Um, but as you get into guys in their mid thirties and up, um, the smart guys in the business know that cause most of them are health nuts anyway, um, versus a lot of alcoholics and drug addicts back in the day, which was also hilarious and wheezing on the guy's side, not a music on the girl's side. 

Uh, They realize that every 35, you know, your testosterone level starts slowly dropping. So by the time you're 40 it's down by the time you're 45, it's gone. So in getting their lab test on there, doing hormone panels and starting to either do a little testosterone shot in the ass every week, or there's a, like a hormone palette where they can stick a testosterone pellet under your skin, um, that will release itself over six months, which is super easy, which is what I do. 

Because if you don't put bunker testosterone, your bad estrogen gets high. Right. Which is why guys, even if they look like magic, Mike have an erection that it's not lock hard or it's semi and they're wearing cock rings and in videos and. That I've seen. And the conquering is a sure sign of my big blanket and fully hard. 

Um, and I, and I've actually told a couple guys look, man, it's I know you don't want to think this, but like human evolution, health, whatever your age, go to this place here, they do all the three, four on tasks. Look, if you shop that day, if you can't shoot yourself in the ass, you can have them do it, or just get the Rowan implant. 

And you're literally going to. You know, a rock hard deck. If the wind blows like you're 22 again, and it also protects you from prostate cancer, heart disease, dementia, and a bunch of other shit like hormone balancing is so important for men and women, but for men, the testosterone shots are important. And any guys in the industry who is, I would say is I was going to say over 35 things change when you're young, you'll stick your Dick in anything. It's true. Right. But if you're like 35 or over, and you've been in the business or just in life a while, you know, there's going to be some young girl shows up drunk and her PESI smells like dead fish or something, and you're going to have to fuck her because her test came back perfectly fine. And you're just not going to be into it. 

And your deck isn't either. So I suggest, and back in the day, the smart producer directors. Would, um, throw it by I'd graphic. I'd be like start chilling 30 minutes before the scene. So their Dick would be hard for the scene all day. So I just one do your hormone testing starting at 35 and start doing testosterone in the business. 

We're not really for men. Um, and yeah, get a prescription for Viagra if you're working in the industry, because there's going to be times when you're going to need it. Yeah. I'm going to say I've been, I've been cruising through some of the porn hub videos that keep that. Sent over suggested to me on my channel, on my channel, which I apparently haven't can't log into and have to contact them because I'm like, wait, I have like 10,000 subscribers and 120,000 views. 

Should I not be making money off this? So I've got to get in there and deal with them sidebar. But, um, I've been looking at some of the guys now. Oh my God. There's like a whole plethora of just mid thirties, just gorgeous Italians, French guys. You know, funny at pretty near to models. I'm like making a list and checking it twice for Christmas. 

[00:43:52] Matthew Holliday: I mean, I can imagine a lot of it, especially in this day and age, it's the guys in their thirties and forties that can afford to pay the women to make content. The guys in their twenties, that's gotta be trade cause they don't have a couple of thousand dollars laying around to make something. 

[00:44:05] Samantha St. James: Well, right. And the older, smarter guys that are in the business. Are going to know that you should have different types of girls, different looks in your, in, in different scenes. If you're doing, if you're doing your own only fans or content creation, like there's fans are going to want to see you with super young girl with no boobs, skinny, a BBW, maybe someone's in, maybe somebody requests, you know, a black girl, somebody wants an Asian girl, like whatever, but they're also wise enough to know that. 

And it's hilarious. Cause they're telling like I've been told, oh, Milts are 35. Mr. Under 40, 30, 5 to 40 I'm like no, back in the day, MILFs were 40 to 50. They wouldn't, but girls who were not 39 ish and now it's like, oh, we only come 35 to 40. I'm like, okay. One, the average growth of the business is 25. It looks fucking 35 to 42. 

Nobody's buying that any of these girls 30, you know, and they're in there, they're 30, 35 are actually melts and that's a huge market. Because I haven't been found on the personal side, you know, most guys that are like, I want to say 25. I don't try to date guys in their twenties, but most guys like in their late twenties to say late thirties are not dating women, their age, they're dating women like in their forties and fifties, because. 

You know, you're smarter and more successful your shit together. You don't care. You don't want to look at their phone. You're not going to text them 15 times a day and that, you know what you're doing in the bedroom. And that's the huge turn on to much younger guys. So to me, a lot of these content creator guys, if I do make a trip out to LA and I finally get contact with Alma and be like, oh, I will definitely do a scene with. 

For content, because it's going to bring me, you know, it is going to bring me hits on all these video channels that I apparently someone's making money off of. You. I will do it. I w this was, yeah, I would do content tree, but it's going to have to be with like one of the, one of these top 10 guys, top 15 guys. 

Uh, and it would require them, you know, plugging me three times a week and it's a whole deal. Right. You don't just do it and hope for the best, but, um, I would definitely do a good scene with them cause it's like, oh, I definitely want to fuck you because some of these guys just I've seen them on video. 

And when they were the girl, they have chemistry with it's hot. It's not just like mechanical bullshit. 

[00:46:20] Matthew Holliday: So that's actually kind of a, it leads me to a new question that we didn't discuss beforehand. How much of fucking and the porn industry is because of purely money or how many people like really enjoy the sex and want to make money on. 

[00:46:35] Samantha St. James: I feel it's a lot less now than it used to be. Just from what I've seen. Like I've seen. And again, this kinda goes to the, how good is the girl in the scene and does she really enjoy it? Right. So I've seen some really niche stuff. Like I stumbled upon a, I think it's a channel on PornHub called Mormon girl. 

And it's an up, well, here's the P but here's the thing it's shot with like a really harsh light and a black background. Like, it's like a, it's like a table it's like a table and a desk, uh, you know, in a black background, black set with like one light it's really, really harsh. The guy is like the pre. All dressed up. 

The girls are very young, very pretty, very natural, very naked, you know, and he is, they're being inducted into the church and, you know, he breeds them all. Cause it's, it's kind of true to life. But, uh, anyway, that is really the girls look like they would be in there the scene. He looks like the guy that would really be there. 

They actually all look like they're enjoying it. It's well shot versus some of the other boy, girl machines I've seen. Were just the race to the bottom. And how many decks can we shove in this girl's falls at once and were the girls look like they're obviously exaggerating it and faking it, like screaming and yelling, every dirty thing they've ever heard, but like they're wincing during the entire scene. 

I, I think a lot of it is for the money and girls figuring if they do more and more and more hardcore stuff, look at even more and more popular. You know, if there's a girl that can take four dicks in their ass, they're going to be the most popular girl. Then they'll get way more bookings and way more money for their content. 

It's sort of a vicious cycle. Um, but I've seen a lot of stuff that is really, I would say unpleasant, but it's not a turnout and important supposed to be a turnout. Like if I watch a video and I'm just not like. Really turned on and want to like, you know, have one of my boyfriends over and masturbate too. 

And I'm like, you know, I, I can, I can tell when people are just not into it and going through the motions, but, um, it just, like I said, it depends. I think some of the older female male actors, they're in their mid thirties who are paired together, well, do some really hot stuff and you can tell if they're really into it. 

And then there's just a lot of the younger girls. With really any age guy and it just looked like these girls are just doing what they think they're supposed to do. 

[00:48:53] Matthew Holliday: Yeah, 

[00:48:54] Samantha St. James: I dunno. 

[00:48:55] Matthew Holliday: that's a big thing in a pornography of courses. Join it, is it realistic ish, realistic enough that you can fool your brain. 

[00:49:05] Samantha St. James: And I'm just trusting me. I'm gonna go look up the Mormon girls thing. There's a couple of, I'm going to like reach out to them, like, and just you're like, you guys want to review, like anything you're shooting in that locker room is amazing. They've done some other stuff. That might've been shot earlier or later. 

I'm not sure outside, but if they stock stick with this one kind of look and genre, it's, it's really fun. Cool. Um, and yeah, it's, and it's a huge turnoff, like, trust me, it's like, I, my fireman boyfriend was over and he's like, what are you watching the porn out now? And I'm like, you gotta see this. And he's like, oh my God, I'm not normally into like the young girl thing with the older guy, but the fuck is that I'm like, exactly right. 

You know, getting all warmed up, watching that. So that's a, that's a big blood for them because it's rare that I see any kind of new newish born. That's really a turn on or any, any boy, girl stuff that's super hot. Um, I can't remember. See, there's a couple other sites I've seen that are actually shooting like on a, on a set with decent wardrobe with hair and makeup and there's boy, girl stuff. 

That's super fucking hot. I can't remember the companies, but there are people still doing it that are really like purists, you know, like, no we're going to decently really fucking hot. We're going to get our own fan base. We're not in this quantity versus quality. Right. And I, and I'm hoping that there's so much quantity and so much garbage out there that maybe more of the industry will start turning around again and do more quality stuff versus quantity. 

But I don't know, you know, I'm just sort of dipping my toes back into this for forever. You know, fun and profit. So, 

[00:50:39] Matthew Holliday: you mentioned that and we're just about at a time. So one last question. What, what made you decide to get back in. 

[00:50:45] Samantha St. James: um, kind of how I got into it professionally in the first place I'm single, uh, single looking to mingle figured I would dip my toes back into it and see what's going on. Everybody seems to be shooting in Florida. I obviously have ridiculous amount of credits and. You know, a reputation as being reliable, whatever good scene. 

So I started flipping through a lot of the, know the bigger male talent and I'm like, oh yeah, I'm fucking all these guys. I mean, they're, they're all very good. They were guys, I would have sex with if I met them at a bar, but if I'm going to have sex with them on video, which is even more of a turn on the whole thing and I'm getting paid fucking fabulous. 

[00:51:26] Matthew Holliday: Yeah. 

[00:51:27] Samantha St. James: So that's it. I'm single for fun and profit. I also have a great location that I can either run out for shoots or have people traveling talent, stay and show that. Um, so again for nonprofit, right. 

[00:51:41] Matthew Holliday: All right. Well, 

[00:51:43] Samantha St. James: who doesn't like to come back, right? What's your face? Just at a comeback. Um, the Charlie Sheen's girlfriend, old girlfriend, the little blonde girl, Katie Morgan. She just said to come back after 10 years, 15 years. She's the really, the only one I've seen that's that was even around then, if it really is. That's the other funny part, there is nobody male talent or female talent that was working when I was working around it. 

The big stars were a lot older than me when I started. And a lot of the girls that continue to work or out of the business, it's a whole new crop, like 18 to 28 year olds with maybe a couple of maybe a handful of 35 to 40 year olds. But not much. It's a lot of very, very young girls now. Which, I mean, the industry never learned that like your average guy, except for nice, most men are not into seeing someone that looks like their, you know, brother's daughter getting fucked by six guys. 

Like it's just kind of a weird thing with the young girls and men that are not super young. And the guys with money who are really getting into a really get into porn would spend money on it or not your younger guys. So they're really not into that super young girl thing, but. 

[00:52:55] Matthew Holliday: Yeah, no, I definitely think some go a little bit on the flat-chested slim hips. They go a little too far. she's 18. I know she's 18, but she doesn't. 

[00:53:07] Samantha St. James: Well, you know, and I know our time, but that's the thing back when they were first starting to try the adult Guild, you know, where you get health insurance, join it like sag, minimum, minimum rates for seen, uh, adult, but paws and adult welfare and EAM. And all those organizations were really working towards all that. 

And there is some movement on that now. They were trying to pass a law that you had to be 21 to do porn, because if you have to be 21 to drink or get a medical marijuana card, and now in a lot of states to buy cigarettes or vaping products, getting in doing porn at 18 is a really big life decision that you may or may not be mentally, psychologically, emotionally, spiritually able to handle at 18 versus 21. 

And it is a big difference in your mindset between 18 and 21. And. It will be down of like girls who've spiraled into alcoholics and drug abuse and suicides. I mean, it's, it's the way it is going up exponentially with the rate of more and more younger girls getting into it. And I've always been a believer that I don't, I don't think, uh, I think you should have to be 21, but. 

[00:54:16] Matthew Holliday: Oh, that looks like a pretty decent place to end it. So Samantha, where can everyone find you online? 

[00:54:23] Samantha St. James: I have a Twitter, which is at the real Meridian, which was the name I started working under in the industry. But that's a talk for another day. It's at the real Meridian on Twitter. And it does say Samantha Saint James, the real Meridian bitches on the Twitter. Um, I have my FetLife profile for those people who are more into the fetish BDSM community. Again, it's under Samantha, Saint James. Um, I don't think it comes up if you Google it. Cause FetLife is still kind of a little underground thing. What else? I apparently like I've been told, have PornHub X hamster cuts for sale, many bids, but I do not own a run any of those. So I will be I'm Googling myself and checking on those later. 

[00:55:16] Matthew Holliday: Yeah. And I'll put a link to the FET life in the show notes. So that way people don't have to try and find you. 

[00:55:20] Samantha St. James: Yeah, FetLife and, um, and Twitter, my deems are open. So if anybody is interested in, uh, art model content, uh, which I actually enjoy, and I will do some fetish, BDSM, nude art model stuff on trade, if it's an amazing photographer, uh, and there's a location involved there, there's some things I will do on trade, but it's definitely photography and it's definitely art stuff. DME on Twitter, I suppose, or DME on fat life. Um, I answer as many messages as I can get to, you know, daily or weekly I'm organized and on time. And, um, I do require a deposit on everything I'm book now, though, because so many flags matches talent, photographers, video people, so many flakes. So I require a deposit upfront just to hold my time. 

[00:56:12] Matthew Holliday: That's interesting, especially considering how photographers complain about model flakes. 

[00:56:16] Samantha St. James: Oh my God. No, it's hilarious. If photographers complain about models and adult talent, and I'm like, I was on hold for two scenes last week and they said Wednesday and Friday, then it became Friday and Saturday. And this is a big company that shoots in Florida with big LA male talent. They're kind of C listers, but whatever. 

Um, and they literally. One of these idiots showed up COVID positive. They didn't have any other talented book. And they think everyone else is exposed. I'm like, okay. And, but there was other local talent that could have booked in. And so I lost bill scenes and I'm like, you have in the future. If I, if you, you know, I'm doing two scenes and we talked about for what I was going to do 2,500, I'm like, you're paying me half of that up front to hold the date. 

And it's good forever until we shoot. But that is a non-refundable deposit because I wasted four days of bookings and I could have done a couple of. Um, foot fetish, but job things. Cause people love my feet again, it was always the thing. Well, my feet are back, so and so I lost money. So there's more flaky models and talent, but I'm telling you, there's a lot of, a lot of unprofessional photographers and videographers around now. 

[00:57:23] Matthew Holliday: Do you have any ongoing projects you'd like to mention. And with that, we are done. Check us out@thensfwphotographypodcast.com on Twitter. As at NSFW photography, Instagram at the NSFW photography podcast, and subscribe at your favorite podcast. Before I let everyone go. I have a quote that I think really applies to stay as discussion from Xena Shrek, from demons of the flesh, the complete guide to left-hand path sex magic sex is like an atom bomb, a potent weapon, which fascinates and frightens. 

We're afraid to let it loose. And yet we all have our finger on the button. Have a great weekend.